Geoffrey West: Urban Scaling Laws and the Future of Cities (470)

<p>Geoffrey West, theoretical physicist and distinguished professor at the Santa Fe Institute, on urban scaling laws,cities that grow faster than exponential, and what happens when populations start to shrink. He treats the future of cities as the future of the planet. Cities drive resource use and climate change because that is where the people are. Without immigration, much of Europe and the United States would already be shrinking, even while other places cannot build housing fast enough. </p><p>A city, for him, is a machine for social interaction: A talks to B talks to C. Globalization widens that loop and also risks sanding off the diversity of thought cities need. He wants the rise in living standards kept, and energy returned to the sun. A science of cities would predict the rough baseline for roads, police, crime, and patents from city size alone, then ask why a particular city beats or misses that line. The same scaling laws show up from Cleveland to cities in Chile, China, and Sweden.Episode 469 is the debate on the 2007 paper he co-authored.</p><p>(00:00) Cities need science</p><p>(00:58) Who Geoffrey West is</p><p>(02:06) Cities and the planet</p><p>(07:39) Immigration and the singularity</p><p>(17:39) A machine for interaction</p><p>(23:30) Globalization and diversity</p><p>(27:43) What to sustain</p><p>(36:13) Three concerns</p><p>(42:23) Why cities outlast companies</p><p>(50:42) A science of cities</p><p>(01:02:41) How scaling laws work</p><p>(01:13:02) A precarious planet</p><p>Show notes and transcript:https://wtf4cities.com/2026/10/08/470i_geoffrey-west-theoretical-physicist-and-distinguished-professor-at-the-santa-fe-institute/</p><p>What is The Future for Cities? podcast</p><p>If you would like to support the podcast, check out the <a href="https://wtf4cities.com/wtfbook/" target="_blank" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer">⁠Building Better Cities book⁠</a> or our <a href="https://patreon.com/WTF4CitiesPodcast?utm_medium=unknown&utm_source=join_link&utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator&utm_content=copyLink" target="_blank" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer">⁠Patreon⁠</a>!</p><p>Episode generated with <a href="https://www.descript.com/" target="_blank" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer">⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Descript⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠</a> assistance (<a href="https://get.descript.com/t8h92ehcqryz" target="_blank" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer">⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠affiliate link⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠</a>).</p><p>Music by <a href="h